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Scalibor collars & Leishmaniasis

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Offline Maria

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« on: May 21, 2009, 12:38 PM »
Hi all

Just thought I would mention this.

We have a Labrador who is being treated for canine leishmaniosis and has been on another course of injections. We noticed him being wobbly on his legs and his eye sight going. Turns out he should not have had a scalibor collar on whilst he was having his injections (we were not made aware of this). He has had a reaction to them and today has had a valium injection to try and reverse the situation.

Has anyone else seen or heard of this?

Maria
« Last Edit: May 26, 2009, 11:22 AM by Maria »

Offline Maria

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« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2009, 13:58 PM »
Ok I got it wrong (thats what happens when someone else goes to the vet and you dont) but the situation is that certain breeds of dogs can have reactions to the scalibor collars, one of them being labradors. Ours unfortunately has had a reaction and has been poisoned by it. The intravenous valium injection was to get his appetite up and to try and stop him from being depressed. I wont go into the details he is going through right now as it is far from pleasent. Will keep you informed as to whether he recovers or not, fingers crossed.

Offline Clive

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« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2009, 16:11 PM »
I saw Arvac the vet in the forum earlier and hoped he would have an answer for you Maria, he appears to have not seen this topic... Why don't you send him a PM for some info?

Best of luck and hope the dog recovers quickly
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Offline Maria

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« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2009, 23:39 PM »
Hi Clive

I did pm Avark today and have had a reply, thanks for the suggestion.

Unfortunately our lovely Rocky lost the fight this afternoon  :'(. Will report more when feeling a bit better.

Many thanks

Maria

Offline Clive

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« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2009, 09:49 AM »
Sorry to hear that Maria, ... :(
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« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2009, 14:49 PM »
Hi Maria,

Very sorry to hear about this. All my sympathy.

Simon

Offline Sue

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« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2009, 22:25 PM »
So sorry to hear your sad news Maria
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Offline tonyninfas

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« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2009, 09:26 AM »
Hi Maria

Sorry to hear about Rocky.  Hope that you soon start to recover from your loss.

Tony

Offline Maria

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« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2009, 10:01 AM »
Hi all

Many thanks for your kind words, they are much appreciated. We are plodding on and trying to forget Rockys last few hours as they were honestly awful and focus on his many good fun years. The other dogs have been incredibly quiet (very unlike a husky), I guess they are missing their friend to.

In the end his kidneys failed, they could not get rid of the toxins from his body. We are still rather confused at the whole situation as we were told that it was the Scaliber collar that caused it but someone else has mentioned that the symptoms were not of toxicity? I guess we will never know.

Once again many thanks for your kind words.

Maria


Offline lisa

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« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2009, 15:14 PM »
I'm sorry to hear your sad news too Maria. I'm sure you'll find out what is was. Keep us posted.
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Offline Bob M

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« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2009, 16:29 PM »
Really, really sad to hear that story.  You have my sympathy.

Bob 


Offline shiner

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« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2009, 21:04 PM »
Hi all

Many thanks for your kind words, they are much appreciated. We are plodding on and trying to forget Rockys last few hours as they were honestly awful and focus on his many good fun years. The other dogs have been incredibly quiet (very unlike a husky), I guess they are missing their friend to.

In the end his kidneys failed, they could not get rid of the toxins from his body. We are still rather confused at the whole situation as we were told that it was the Scaliber collar that caused it but someone else has mentioned that the symptoms were not of toxicity? I guess we will never know.

Once again many thanks for your kind words.

Maria



Offline shiner

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« Reply #12 on: May 24, 2009, 21:33 PM »
Hi Maria, my sincere sympathy for Rockys demise, at the moment I am giving twice daily doses of tablets to control Leish in my neighbours dog (they only come up at week ends) fortunately his condition is not severe but whilst on a course of injectsions a fresh Scalibar collar was fitted and it caused severe irritation, I took the collar off, this was latterly confirmed by the vet to be the right course of action until the weekly injections had ceased.

I have two Grey hounds who are allergic to Scalibar collars to protect them from the sand fly mosquito I use Exspot(very strong0 or Advantex and use a canine citronella spray(ears legs and under belly) when out walking early mornings and evenings,I give my self a spray and it seems to work. Unlike my neighbours my dogs are not left out side at night.

Offline Maria

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« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2009, 11:29 AM »
Hi everyone again many thanks for your kind words, they really are much appreciated.

Shiner our vet did mention about giving Rocky in the future some drops instead of using a collar. I shall find out more information on this which maybe of some use to you and others?

Also I have found a very interesting website which helps explain all things Leishmaniasis in simple terms the link to their site is http://www.leishmaniasis.info/

Thought I would just post a little photo of Rocky taken in March this year.

Offline PeterJ

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« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2009, 20:50 PM »
Dear Maria,

So sorry to hear about your dog...his last few days sound just like our black lab who died from Leishmaniasis last October...blindness, confusion, wobbly on the legs..it was all so dreadful, and a  very similar death to our other black lab who died 4 years previously here from Ehrlichiosis. I really believe labradors do not have the resistance to fight the illnesses here...possibly inter~breeding, but who knows. I will never again have another labrador in this country...and the second one was spanish born and bred. When i see all the dogs in the campo without much care and affection it makes me so angry...and they live for years!!!!!

Best wishes, Brenda (& Peter)

Offline Maria

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« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2009, 21:59 PM »
Hi Brenda & Peter

Many thanks for your post and im very sorry to hear about your 2 labs. I totally agree with you about labradors for whatever reason they have little resistance to the diseases here and in-breeding was something we talked about.

I, like you, get very angry and upset about the stray dogs and those who live in the campo with little love and affection, I just wonder how many of them actually die an awful death. Seeing what Rocky went through with medication, those other poor animals must have a slow painful death.

I had never heard of Ehrlichiosis but have just looked it up and wow leismaniasis and ehrlichiosis are so similar.

Im having to treat our Leonberger at the moment for Leishmaniasis as well but he is a younger dog and healthy (no clinical signs of leish) so fingers crossed he will respond well to the treatment.

Thanks again for your post.

Maria

Offline Maria

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« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2009, 12:41 PM »
Dear all

I have been writting this blog/eperience/info and thought it maybe worth sharing and maybe people can contribute to help all us pet owners gain a little more knowledge.

http://www.kierstenrowland.com/2009/05/our-experience-with-canine-leishmaniasis/

Maria
« Last Edit: June 01, 2009, 11:29 AM by Maria »

Simon

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« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2009, 17:24 PM »
Hi Maria,

I'm really grateful for your continuing updates n the Leishmaniasis issue, it's something that I need to research on much further, even though from what I see we live in a relatively low risk zone, i.e. there are few of the dangerous sand fly species present here north of the Ebro - but see below.

I ought to say too, how much I admire you for carrying on this 'mission' despite poor Rocky's fate - but as you know from PMs I have a 'take' on that!

But, for more open debate; as far as I can see from a very brief revue, there seems to be just two species of sand fly that are the culprits here, and that there are ways of at least reducing the risk of infection. According to a study cited by CABI Abstract the 'vector',  i.e. carrying species are Phlebotomus (Larroussius) ariasi Tonnoir and P. (L.) perniciosus Newstead, and that these species are contained to within given areas. From what I see of the abstract (I don't have access to the full report) they are limited to humid zones along the coast and up the Ebro river - classic mosquito areas in fact. Various dog sites give common sense hints as to reducing the risk of infection based on avoiding contact during the night when the flies are most active and keeping dogs both indoors and at least above ground level. My personal experience of living in malarial zones, i.e. coastal Latin America, bears this out - one's own behaviour is a very valid defense!

But there's something that I haven't seen in Leish posts so far - that Leish can also be transmitted by sheep ticks (Sp. Garrapatas), which is a big problem for us where we live (paradoxically they seem to be worse in the city here in Tarragona, where there are loads of pet dogs, rather than in the country, where our village goatherd, with a huge herd, seems to be on top of controlling the pests!). We use Frontline Plus to protect our huskies from fleas and ticks, but it strikes me that the problem with this is rather like shutting the door after the horse has bolted so to speak, as the pests are killed after biting and ingesting the poison. But I suspect that in the case of ticks the big problem is parasites or infections that get into the bloodstream along with the eggs (ticks are parasitic, the host is essential for their lifecycle - OK, you can start scratching now >:D)) and Frontline kills the tick before it reaches the egg laying stage. I can certainly vouch for the efficacy of Frontline, however, and my vet states that there is a degree of deterrence as an element of the toxin in present on the hair oils and epidermis, but ticks seem to be determined to overcome this at times.

On to your debate about Labradors. I really don't know how one breed can be more vulnerable than another, but I have a pet (oh no Simon, not again!) theory that pure breeds are in general more vulnerable to diseases that mongrels - but I guess that this opens a whole new can of worms (no, not those worms!!!)

Lastly, phew! A tip about making links on the Forum, which I have adapted from the superb advice given by Lisa and Technopat - although the original posts seem to have dissapeared!

Write your text and then highlight it
Click on the 'Insert Hyperlink' icon
Type an '=' before the first square bracket, ']',
Then write your text after the '=' sign
NB don't leave any gaps or spaces when you do this.
Nota Muy Buen: check that it all works before you sign off and go to bed!!!

It's amazingly simple once  you've done it a few times - and that coming from me is saying something :technodevil:

Regs

Simon
« Last Edit: May 31, 2009, 17:44 PM by Simon »

Offline Maria

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« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2009, 12:03 PM »
Hi Simon

Thanks for your post, I hope having somewhere to post our experiences can help all of us, over the years, gain information and knowledge. Im doing this because :-
1) Im treating another one of our dogs for leish (they have always had the collars on)
2) I would like to try and understand the disease
3) I have an interest in all things medical, human or animal. Working with animals (horses and veterinary hospital) most of my life, I guess its natural.
4) To provide knowledge for people

The information you give is completely correct about keeping dogs indoors at night or above ground level, I have also read that numerous times but the practicalities of it are not so straight forward ie if your home at dusk, if you have an upstairs, the breed of dog (husky will not come in at night), can you imagine how hot it would be in the house. We have lots of defenses up against fly, mosquitoes and sand fly but they still get in the house! Where I got Khumbu (siberian husky) from in the Sierra de Gredos, they are Leish free! They say due to altitude and wind?

I had no idea that Leish can be transmitted by sheep ticks  :o, I have not read that anywhere at all. I dont know the best method of controlling these things but if I remember rightly Arvak gave some advice on the "anti-tick treatment post". We used to use Exspot but the dogs reacted badly to it, they would roll and try to get away from it?? We havnt had a problem with ticks since using the collars, not sure if that is coincidence or if the collars do work?

Im sure like you that all "pedigree" dogs are more vulnerable to disease rather than mongrels. I have not read anywhere that Labradors are susceptible to it, just the posts on here, thats 3, I have read though that German Shephards and Dobermans are susceptible, why? Who knows! They are 2 completely different breeds. I would have thought that short haired dogs would be more likely to get bitten than dogs with long or double coats?

Anyway I hope that people continue to post up their experiences to help us all.

Enough from me for now.   :speechless:

Maria

PS I dont want to sound completely thick but the links advice, ummm can you give more advice? I have redone the link to the other post, which works now I think, my mouse has a mind of its own recently  it deletes what it likes, highlights what it likes etc!! Bad mouse.

Offline tonyninfas

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« Reply #19 on: June 02, 2009, 09:09 AM »
Well I am pretty sure that our dog, Millie caught leish from a sand-fly on the Ebro Delta.  She is a campo dog and her regular tests showed that she was leish free until the test a few weeks after she had had her one and only visit to the beach which came back positive - and she was wearing a Scalibor collar.  So no more visits to the beach for either of our dogs !!