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Why don't the Spanish 'do' marmalade?

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Offline John C

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« on: August 29, 2009, 12:07 PM »
I know it's neither a tapa nor a tipple, but can anyone answer a question that's been bugging me for the last couple of years?  For reasons that escape me. when in Spain I like to breakfast on croissant and marmalade - something I rarely have in the UK.  Whilst getting a good supply of croissants isn't difficult.  Carrefour sells decent ones, but a little bakery in Arcos de la Frontera sells the real McCoy - big, flakey and buttery).  Marmalade is another matter.  Dia in the village usually carries a single brand of undistinguished orange 'marmalade' which just doen't have the tang it should.  Carrefour, last time I was there, was scarcely any better with the same brand and something even worse decorating its shelves.   Meanwhile, back in the UK, Sainsbury's carry over two dozen varieties - thick cut, thin cut, golden, Oxford, Breakfast,  Seville, etc.,  and that's not counting outre things like lime, lemon or mixed citrus.  (I've not yet tried Morrison's on Gibraltar since, on principle, I'm resist going to that temple of all things English with regard to food when in Spain).

On my way down to the local shops in Alcala I pass avenues of orange trees - in season local barmen nip out and pick the fruits to make the freshest orange juice you'll ever have.  Not too far away there are orange groves aplenty and Seville - surely in our minds if not in reality, home of oranges - is less than two hours away.  Despite global warming, I've yet to wonder through the orange groves of Kent so how come we have a better grasp on what to do with all those excess oranges than the Spanish?  It can't all be to do with our sailors needing protection from scurvy can it?  So, why don't the Spanish 'do' marmalade'? 

John

Offline Clive

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« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2009, 14:24 PM »
Hi John, a search for the word "marmalade" found me the great topic from a while back. Fascinating stuff

http://www.iberianatureforum.com/index.php/topic,769.0.html

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Offline Petrea

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« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2009, 21:56 PM »
Funny, exactly today I've urgently been chasing sodium benzoate, which I happened to run out of unexpectedly while cooking salsa de chile!  :'(

Even my Spanish teacher and her mother (who used to be is a cook) couldn't help me!  :noidea:

The farmacia was willing to order a minimum of 250 g for monday!  :speechless:

So: it seems to be correct: the Spanish don't do marmelade! Or conserve the salsas!  :o
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Offline Bob M

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« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2009, 22:24 PM »
Here is an interesting associated question.  What is the difference between jam and marmalade?

British people seem genetically programmed to know the difference, but it seems to me that it's not that easy to define.

Bob 

Offline Clive

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« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2009, 22:59 PM »
Marmalade is made from citrus fruits and jams are made from non citrus fruits..... Also, citrus fruits are in groves and non citrus are orchards :)

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Offline Jesus Contreras

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« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2009, 01:09 AM »
It is not correct to say that in Spain people does not ellaborate mermelade... the thing is that times are changing quickly and it is easier nowadays to buy it in the supermarket.

Some time ago, and yet in some places, the summer fruits not used fresh in short days were/are used for doing "mermelada" or "jalea" (different things), and with the fruit of the Membrillo (quince?) we have always made "dulce de membrillo" also named "carne de membrillo" (a sweet cake only with fruit , similar to a dense mermelade).

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Offline tonyninfas

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« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2009, 09:12 AM »
Marmalade is made from citrus fruits and jams are made from non citrus fruits..... Also, citrus fruits are in groves and non citrus are orchards :)



To the British yes, but on the shelves of the supermarkets up here in Catalonia I have since jars of what can only be trasnlated as, according to the labeling, strawberry marmalade and orange jam.  So where do we go from there ?

Offline Technopat

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« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2009, 21:42 PM »
Greetings All,
Yes, Jesús, quince it is! And delicious it is, too - in small amounts. In Menorca, the combination of a mature queso de Mahón-Menorca with quince is out of this world!

As Clive rightly points out, citrus/groves and non-citrus/orchards it is - except for the olives.

Spanish industrial mermeladas are invariably sweet and excessively runny (Sp- anyone?) even the orange ones. Every time I broach the subject with Spanish friends, they always tell me that their grandmother or their great-aunt used to make her own bitter orange marmelade.

As for translations, when El Corte Inglés launched their own label potato crisps, the packets said "potato chips", obviously 'cos the guys & gals in the marketing dept. had done their MBAs in the States. They soon changed it to "potato crisps", because I'd imagine that the sales in those regions of Spain densely populated with resident or visiting Brits didn't correspond to expectations.

Oh-how-I-miss-my-coarse-cut-bitter-orange-marmelade-of-a-morning regs.,
Technopat
« Last Edit: September 13, 2009, 01:43 AM by Technopat »
Technopat's disclaimer: If this posting seems over the top and/or gets your goat (Sp. anyone?), please accept my apologies and don't take it personally - it's just my instinctive tendency to put my foot in it whenever/wherever possible. See also:
http://www.iberianatureforum.com/index.php/topic,266

Offline Technopat

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« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2009, 02:26 AM »
PS.
My restaurant chappie asked me how to translate compota de tomate, which, contrary to the acidic tinned tomato puré we know from making bolognese back in the UK, is sweet. I convinced him, more or less, that as the tomato is a fruit (something no self-respecting Spaniard will ever accept*), it would clearly come under the category of compote, but I could see that he thought I was bluffing... :dancing:

*Not sure 'bout the Portuguese, but proposal for nationwide iberianatureforum survey: Is the tomato a fruit? As IBNforumers are to be found in just about every corner of this peninsula, we should be able to get a statistically meaningful result.

Yet-another-breakfast-without-that-coarse-cut-awaits regs.,
Technopat
Technopat's disclaimer: If this posting seems over the top and/or gets your goat (Sp. anyone?), please accept my apologies and don't take it personally - it's just my instinctive tendency to put my foot in it whenever/wherever possible. See also:
http://www.iberianatureforum.com/index.php/topic,266

Offline Dave

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« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2009, 11:46 AM »
Hi All
Quote from Sceince Q and A's
To really figure out if a tomato is a fruit or vegetable, you need to know what makes a fruit a fruit, and a vegetable a vegetable. The big question to ask is, DOES IT HAVE SEEDS? If the answer is yes, then technically, you have a FRUIT. This, of course, makes your tomato a fruit. It also makes cucumbers, squash, green beans and walnuts all fruits as well. VEGETABLES such as, radishes, celery, carrots, and lettuce do NOT have seeds (that are part of what we eat) and so they are grouped as vegetables. Now don't go looking for tomatoes next to the oranges in your grocery stores; fruits like tomatoes and green beans are usually (alas, incorrectly) referred to as "vegetables" in most grocery stores and cookbooks.
that has always been my understanding
Regards
Dave

Offline Technopat

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« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2009, 17:59 PM »
Greetings Dave,
AND aguacates and aceitunas:noidea: 'cos if stones don't count, nor do peaches 'n' cherries 'n'...

Pip-pip regs.,
Technopat
Technopat's disclaimer: If this posting seems over the top and/or gets your goat (Sp. anyone?), please accept my apologies and don't take it personally - it's just my instinctive tendency to put my foot in it whenever/wherever possible. See also:
http://www.iberianatureforum.com/index.php/topic,266

Offline Technopat

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« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2009, 18:21 PM »
Greetings All,
Just remembered why I popped in 'ere a moment ago - only to get side-tracked by  Dave's seedy posting:

Mrs Tp, ever eager to compensate for yours truly having renounced typical English fare, tea, real ale and my favourite Indian restaurant in Tooting  :angel: - in some cases, but not always, compensated by the discovery of some great Spanish dishes, yesterday brought home a jar of Mercadona's own label marmalade. Verdict: not bad at all - just a wee bit sweet, but perfectly edible. The extra sweetness can be offset by not putting sugar in yer tea - Mercadona also sells Tetley teabags - good enough for emergencies.

Is-globalisation-all-bad? regs.,
Technopat
Technopat's disclaimer: If this posting seems over the top and/or gets your goat (Sp. anyone?), please accept my apologies and don't take it personally - it's just my instinctive tendency to put my foot in it whenever/wherever possible. See also:
http://www.iberianatureforum.com/index.php/topic,266

Offline Dave

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« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2009, 18:36 PM »
Hi TP and All
Also quite good is Eroski´s mermelada de Naranja Amarga (hope I spelt that right). Mind you at the moment Maria´s plum jam is excellent, so I have not felt the need to purchase shop jams. By the way stones are seeds, so Olives and Avacados are strictly fruit eaten as vegetables  :booklook:
Regards
Dave
wot! no seedy smiley

Offline Clive

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« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2009, 21:18 PM »
Nice one Dave..... :)

Just had some friends to stay... One from Jerez and one from Madrid.... The lady from Madrid loved Sue's home made thick cut bitter marmalade whilst the guy from Jerez spat it out, scraped it off the (wholemeal) toast and poured oil and salt on it instead..... Well, jerez does have the reputation of being the largest city of "villagers" in Spain.... :) (I translated that politely so as not to offend :) )
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Offline nick

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« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2009, 10:31 AM »
The plot thickens. Just heard on a bbc radio 4 documentary on food myths that the original English marmalade was not made from oranges at all but was made from quince. The name came from the Portuguese for quince "marmelo"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00mpmm6/Food_Programme_Food_Myths/

http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marmelo

And this is also where the Spanish word mermelada comes from.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marmalade
The Romans learned from the Greeks that quinces slowly cooked with honey would "set" when cool (though they did not know about fruit pectin). Greek melim?lon or "honey fruit"—for most quinces are too astringent to be used without honey, and in Greek m?lon or "apple" stands for all globular fruits—was transformed into "marmelo."
« Last Edit: September 21, 2009, 10:35 AM by nick »
Nick
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Offline nick

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« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2009, 10:34 AM »
Re-reading the old thread I see some of you have already made a similar point on the origin of the word mermalade

http://www.iberianatureforum.com/index.php/topic,769.0.html

And now I come to think of it, I suspect I once knew about the quince origin, but had completely forgotten. As a general point, how hard it is to retain all this interesting information!
« Last Edit: September 21, 2009, 10:37 AM by nick »
Nick
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Offline Technopat

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« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2009, 13:41 PM »
Greetings Nick 'n' All,

Re. Nick's
Quote
The plot thickens
, I think you'll find it's the pectin wot does it :dancing:

Sopt-me-if-you've-read-this-before,-but-a-mature-Mahón-cheese-with-membrillo-is-out-of-this-world regs.,
Technopat

PS.
Just remembered that when I was a poor student I lived almost entirely on cheese 'n' marmalade sarnies - talk about the past catching up with you!
Technopat's disclaimer: If this posting seems over the top and/or gets your goat (Sp. anyone?), please accept my apologies and don't take it personally - it's just my instinctive tendency to put my foot in it whenever/wherever possible. See also:
http://www.iberianatureforum.com/index.php/topic,266

Offline Dave

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« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2009, 13:55 PM »
Hi TP and All
Wot not Baked beans  :P
Regards
Dave

Offline John C

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« Reply #18 on: September 24, 2009, 00:05 AM »
Thanks one and all for the interesting comments on this topic!

John

Offline nick

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« Reply #19 on: September 24, 2009, 00:37 AM »
Actually, in final answer to your question John...some of them do (including my mate Armand)

http://www.google.es/search?q=mermelada+de+naranja&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:es-ES:official&client=firefox-a

This  recipe claims to be from the Canaries
http://www.recetasdemama.es/2008/01/mermelada-de-naranja-amarga/
Nick
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